On Apr 15, 11:05 am, "Edward Dolan" <edo...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
> "JimmyMac" <jimmyma...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
>
> news:b1d97cfa-73d8-4d49-8a2a-30318baecf78@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
>
> > On Apr 14, 7:44 pm, "Edward Dolan" <edo...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
> >> "JimmyMac" <jimmyma...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
>
>
>>news:161e67c9-2dd8-48e6-b50b-3d107208e031@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> >> > On Apr 12, 11:12 pm, "Edward Dolan" <edo...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
> >> >> "JimmyMac" <jimmyma...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
>
> >>
>>news:0f58039b-ce8a-4f44-b719-aeba4e978591@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> >> >> > On Apr 11, 7:50 pm, "Edward Dolan" <edo...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
> >> >> >> "JimmyMac" <jimmyma...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
>
> >> >>
>>news:956555c1-b721-4821-bb4a-5b84e133ff98@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> >> >> >> > On Apr 10, 11:04 pm, "Edward Dolan" <edo...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
> >> >> >> >> "JimmyMac" <jimmyma...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
>
> >> >> >>
>>news:76ce9e72-6d43-4f05-8215-005678218384@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >> >> >> >> [...]
>
> >> >> >> >> > The insensitive misanthrope Dolan knows nothing of the
> >> >> >> >> > sacrifice,
> >> >> >> >> > pain
> >> >> >> >> > and suffering that will haunt others for the rest of their
> >> >> >> >> > lives.
> >> >> >> >> > I
> >> >> >> >> > presume his time in the Navy was a none too traumatic
> >> >> >> >> > peacetime
> >> >> >> >> > stint.
>
> >> >> >> >> The Great Ed Dolan is the Greatest Hero known to him.
Believe
> >> >> >> >> you
> >> >> >> >> me,
> >> >> >> >> it
> >> >> >> >> is
> >> >> >> >> no easy thing to survive 4 years in the Navy during
peacetime.
> >> >> >> >> The
> >> >> >> >> amount
> >> >> >> >> of
> >> >> >> >> shit you have to put up with staggers the mind. Once I even
had
> >> >> >> >> to
> >> >> >> >> clean
> >> >> >> >> garbage pails!
>
> >> >> >> > Hero is one of the most misused words in any language and
Conan
> >> >> >> > the
> >> >> >> > Librarian perpetuates its abuse here undermining and
cheapening
> >> >> >> > the
> >> >> >> > term properly reserved for what a hero is by definition.
>
> >> >> >> > Psychologists or sociologists may explain some day what it is
> >> >> >> > about
> >> >> >> > that distant land of green mountains and fields merging with
> >> >> >> > azure
> >> >> >> > sea, that for millennia has acted as a magnet for foreigners
who
> >> >> >> > sought glory there and found frustration, who believed that
in
> >> >> >> > its
> >> >> >> > rice fields and jungles some principle was to be established
and
> >> >> >> > entered only to recede in delusion. When we entered Vietnam,
we
> >> >> >> > became suddenly aware that we were entering into the heart of
> >> >> >> > darkness
> >> >> >> > and the edge of civilization, but we entered. Our country
was
> >> >> >> > beckoning. Illusion and reality blended into the landscape,
and
> >> >> >> > time,
> >> >> >> > as we knew it, stopped and we became ... bothers in arms.
>
> >> >> >> > How does that compare with your peacetime garbage pail
detail?
>
> >> >> >> How do you know what it is like to serve in the military in
> >> >> >> peacetime
> >> >> >> any
> >> >> >> more than I know what it is like to serve in the military
during
> >> >> >> wartime.
> >> >> >> However, I think I would rather serve a couple of years in
wartime
> >> >> >> than
> >> >> >> double that in peacetime. Those garbage pails were really
filthy!
>
> >> >> > The operative words are peace and war and it is easy to draw
> >> >> > conclusion
> >> >> > as to which is preferable. I am surprised that you acquire
> >> >> > assistance
> >> >> > with such an elementary concept.
>
> >> >> The operative word is TIME in service. Most guys in the military
> >> >> during
> >> >> times of war never see any action. When you are young a single
year
> >> >> can
> >> >> seem
> >> >> like a century.
>
> >> > You always were one to favor form over function and quantity over
> >> > quality in your many exchanges. No matter how you slice it ... the
> >> > operative word is actually SERVICE. TIME is an irrelevant
expletive
> >> > [?]
> >> > whereas PEACE and WAR are diametrically opposed indicators that
> >> > differentiate vastly different types of service and the experiences
> >> > inherent to both.
>
> >> You are talking about peace and war, I am talking about time in
service.
> >> I
> >> would rather serve two years in service in time of war than 4 years
in
> >> service in time of peace. What is there about that you do not
understand?
>
> > This all started with you pitchin' a bitch over Harry 's POW/MIA flag
> > which reflects war-time and not peace-time military activity, so who
> > deviated from the topic focus?
>
> That was a separate subject. Try to keep up to speed.
BUT, that set the tone an direction of the discussion from which you
deviated.
> You are so incredibly dense. In
>
> > answer to your question, I would rather serve 2 years in the military
> > than 4 in peace-time, but the more pertinent question is would you
> > rather spend 4 years in the military during peace-time or two year
> > during war-time AND in a war-zone? I answered your question and
> > expect you to extend me the same courtesy.
>
> I would never be dumb enough to end up in a war zone, unless it was of
the
> caliber of WWII of course.
I don't recall the military giving anyone a choice in the matter.
Predictably you did not extend to me the same courtesy that I extended
to you. YOU DID NOT ANSWER MY QUESTION!
> >> >> > Nonetheless military service during
> >> >> > war but not in the war zone is not so very different than
peacetime
> >> >> > service, so there is little required to know what peacetime
service
> >> >> > is
> >> >> > like.
>
> >> >> I suspect this is not true. I think a different ethos prevails in
the
> >> >> military during times of war, whether you are in the war zone or
not.
> >> >> The
> >> >> peacetime military, especially the Navy, is well-known for chicken
> >> >> shit
> >> >> inspections, field days, etc. Sometimes it can seem like a
permanent
> >> >> boot
> >> >> camp that never lets up. Once I got out of the Navy I resolved
never
> >> >> to
> >> >> clean one god damn fucking thing again in my life. Believe you me,
I
> >> >> have
> >> >> kept that resolution with a vengeance!
>
> >> >> > Service in a war zone is another matter altogether and filthy
> >> >> > garbage pails do not comprise or constitute the memories most
> >> >> > haunting. A jerk like you would probably not last a week in
Nam.
> >> >> > If
> >> >> > you ran your mouth like you do here on ARBR, you'd likely get
> >> >> > fragged ... call it friendly fire.
>
> >> >> Military service, whether in time of peace or war, is all about
> >> >> getting
> >> >> long
> >> >> with your fellow prisoners.
>
> > Getting LONG?
>
> Getting along of course.
>
>
>
> >> > As with everything else, you have a twisted and jaded perspective.
> >> > There is rar more to military service that getting on with those
> >> > around you but in time of war those around you could very well be
> >> > prisoners in an enemy prison.
>
> >> >> I liken military service to being in prison.
> >> >> Trust me on this, 4 years in service is twice as long as 2 years
in
> >> >> service
> >> >> and feels like forever when you are young. Thank God we have an
> >> >> all-volunteer well paid professional military now. A conscript
> >> >> military
> >> >> is
> >> >> worthless now that everything is high tech.
>
> >> > As usual, you once again parade you ignorance. The conscripted
> >> > military ensured a cross section and had higher standards in place
for
> >> > entrance. Todays military is far different with lowered standards,
> >> > more members with criminal records even gang members and these are
> >> > the people who are being trained in high-tech an modern military
> >> > tactics and then returned back into society now better trained to
pick
> >> > up where they left off. Now that's a real improvement. You are
such
> >> > an uninformed dunce.
>
> >> You have got everything backwards. The conscript military was
worthless
> >> and
> >> always has been. Half the guys there do not want to be there and do a
> >> piss
> >> poor job of everything. The present professional military is made up
of
> >> warriors who want to be there. Thank God this country still produces
such
> >> types. Nixon was a genius for getting rid of the draft and replacing
it
> >> with
> >> an all- volunteer military.
>
> > Conscription has its drawback as you have pointed out, however so does
> > the volunteer military, especially during poor economic times and
> > higher rate of unemployment when the dregs of humanity are seeking
> > employment of any kind.
>
> The military does not take the dregs of humanity. Such types are usually
> only to be found in our state prisons.
The current military has criminals and gang members in service ... a
well know fact. Are these not dregs? Are ALL dreg in state prisons?
Don't be ridiculous.
> Many of these fall into the category of those
>
> > who would otherwise not want to be in the military and have the
> > inclination to perform accordingly . What do you no understand about
> > that? What makes volunteer versus conscripted candidate, trained in
> > the same fashion, any more professional.
>
> Because they WANT to be there.
Their is a different being "choosing" and "wanting" ... between
employment and unemployment ... between food, clothing and housing
and being without food, clothing and housing. Sometimes choices are
the lesser of two evils, so to speak. Why is it that simple concepts
seem often to elude you?
> Not all in the military are
>
> > "warriors" and today's military is comprised of more criminals, gang
> > members, etc. in a military of reduced standards due to the
> > requirements for ... a few more "good" men". I've got this all
> > backwards? You're not even thinking straight! The bottom line is that
> > neither system is perfect and both have an inherent downside. I
> > recognize this. You don't!
>
> Professional military warriors have always been far superior to
conscripts.
> There is just no comparison at all. We are going back to the standards
of
> warfare that prevailed in the enlightened 18th century before Napoleon
> ruined it with his conscripted armies, a legacy of the French
Revolution.
Another tangent. Nope ... not going down that road.
> I have read studies which show that very many soldiers during WWII would
> never even fire their weapons in battle. It takes a true warrior to kill
and
> to want to kill. We do not value these types enough.
Sure we do. Maybe that is why the ranks of the military now have
criminals and gang members ... professional warriors. How will you
value them when they are back in the sector of society?
> After all, there is a
> time for peace and a time for war, and when it is time for war, we want
the
> best killer-warriors that we can get.
And, that why you were in the peace-time Navy.
> [...]
>
> Regards,
>
> Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota
> aka
> Saint Edward the Great - Order of the Perpetual Sorrows - Minnesota
|
